Stuck shower valve - please help

Hi,

A couple of months ago, I replaced the tile in my tub/shower, and installed new plumbing at the same time. I have a "three-valve" arrangement. one faucet for hot, one fore cold and the one in the middle for tub or shower. Nothing fancy. The brand is Moen. I don't know the model.

The middle valve (what's the correct name?) got really tight after a few weeks. I pulled the cylindrical brass thingie (what's the correct name for that?) and replaced it with a new one. The wear on the cylinder thingie suggested it fit a little too tight. The guy at the hardware store said it was probably just manufactured wrong.

Now the same thing is happening with the new one. It got so tight I couldn't turn it at all. I was afraid I would snap it off. Once again, there are signs of friction on the outside of the brass cylinder thingie

I thought of reducing the diameter of the brass cylinder with emery cloth or something. Or maybe try to hone the hole the brass cylinder goes into?

Or maybe rip out the tile, replace the whole valve, and send the bill to Moen?

What do you all suggest?

Thanks in advance.

Peggy Sue

Hi Peggy Sue, welcome to the forum I am happy you joined us.

It sounds to me like there is something wrong with that valve if twice the same thing happens. Although I have read on the internet that Moen valves do tend to have this problem quite a lot. I can totally imagine your frustration at this as I would be the same but I think I would just take the whole thing out and change it to a different brand. (This is just me, of course).

“How-To” Adjusting Packing Nut.

Greetings duckarama and welcome to the Forum !

First of all, we need to establish some terminology here, and the thingy that you’re dealing with, is called a Diverter Valve. So, let’s just call it the Valve.

What I think has happened, is that part of the Valve has been tightened up too tightly, and making the Valve “seize” up.

You’ll need:
Screwdriver, Phillips/Std to remove the Valve Handle.
Crescent Wrench, 6-8”, (or 6-8” Channel Lock Pliers but not the preferred tool).
Lubricant, WD-40 or LPS Spray, with the Spray Tube.

Remove the Handle, then loosen the Chrome Nut which holds the conical shaped cover against the wall. Remove the Cover and you should see a Brass/Plastic thin “Pipe” about 3” long, and it should be unscrewed, leaving the Packing Nut in place.

The Packing Nut, I think is the culprit here, in that it probably has been tightened down too tightly.

Loosen this nut with your Wrench, but don’t remove it. Tighten it up just with your fingers. Now, on the upper side of the Handle Shaft (that’s called the Stem by the way) squirt some lubricant into the space between the Packing Nut and the Stem.

You should install the Handle on the Stem at this point, without any of the trim, just it.

Now, given that the Packing (which prevents a water leak along the Stem) has been overly compressed, it may take several turns back and forth of the Stem, and maybe more Lube, to get it where is it turning back and forth easily. So, don’t give up too quickly here.

Once you have gotten the Stem where it rotates easily, we now can start tightening the Packing Nut up to it’s proper pressure, but not yet !

We’re going to be using COLD water ONLY for this Tightening procedure, so, reach up and direct the Shower Head away from you, and possibly just sit on the side of the Tub, where you won’t get TOO wet here !

The Stem will only leak when you have the Water turned on, so, turn the Cold Water on full, and you should see a “drip or even a stream” of water, coming out between the Packing Nut and the Stem. Tighten the Packing Nut up ¼ round at a time, as you rotate the Stem back and forth. Don’t get in a rush here, it may take a couple operations for the tightening to take effect. Repeat the quarter turn tightening, until the water drip stops.

The final adjustment to the Packing Nut may seem like it’s not very tight. But that’s ok, it’s supposed to have only enough pressure on the Packing, to stop the leak NOW. It’s possible/probable that at some point in the future (month/year) that you will need to tighten it up a “little” more to stop the “Seepage/Drip” should it occur again.

NOTES/COMMENTS:
I suggested using a Lubricant this time only, because the Stem was said to be seizing. This adjustment does not require any lube normally.

There are numerous applications of the Packing Nut on products other than Moen, for Cold and Hot Valves as well as Diverters. The above procedure can be applied to them, using a segment of the procedure as stated above.

Usually, the Diverter Valve assembly is on the “low pressure” side of the water supply valve(s). It may be that some units will start “seeping” water from the Stem right away, and turning on the Cold Water to do the adjustment, may not be necessary.

The object is to tighten the Packing Nut up where the drip/leak stops, AND the Stem still operates smoothly, with “some” drag when being turned.

Hope this helps.

Have a good Day !
S.W.

Hi,

Chances are, someone will have a similar problem and will Google his or her way to this thread. Fact is, I've got answers! Aren't you happy?

I'm afraid the other replies weren't quite on the right track, though I do appreciate them.

I was able to pull the brass core of the diverter valve. Just unscrew the brass cap -- The stem pokes through it. You'll need a deep socket to remove it. Sorry, I can't remember the necessary size. Moen makes a special tool, but it's a lot cheaper to buy a single deep socket at the hardware store.

The cylinder is a made of heavy brass with various holes drilled into it. It can't be overtightened. It's not designed that way.

it looks like it was manufactured wrong. It is pretty much brand new. I replaced the first one, and it happened again. It only took about a week, each time. The cylinder seems a little too large in diameter. You can see some gouge marks on the outside of the cylinder. I suppose Moen made a whole bunch this way. I hope they have fixed it by now.

I am no expert, but this worked for me. The alternative was to rip out the tile. If you do this, you're on your own.

I got a piece of emery paper, fairly fine grit, and just sort of polished the thing by hand. I kept rubbing until the brass looked shiny and the gouge marks were smoothed out. I'd guess I removed about 1/2 of 1/1000th of an inch of material. It turned smoothly when I put it back in. It's still works fine a month later. No signs of leaks. The stem seals with an O-ring, so it's not going to leak in any case.

I hope this has helped someone.

Peggy Sue

Peggy Sue,

Thank you VERY MUCH for the followup !
Looking forward to other posts from you.

Have a good Day !
S.W.

I have had this SAME problem with a Moen. Not pleased after I read on more than one forum like this that it is not rare. Wish I had looked into it better before I bought. Not that handy, so not sure what I'm going to do here...don't want to call a plumber though, so I guess I'm off to buy a deep socket...

Don't worry. It isn't hard at all. A year has passed and it still works fine. Chances are, my method will work. If you get the right size on the deep socket, getting the thing out is quite easy.

Peggy Sue

Going out to get a deep socket tomorrow and take care of this once and for all (I hope). Any idea what size? I have been looking around online and cannot find the answer...possible I am just not looking in the right place...

Going out to get a deep socket tomorrow and take care of this once and for all (I hope). Any idea what size? I have been looking around online and cannot find the answer...possible I am just not looking in the right place...

Hi Dan,

I'm not at home now, and I can't recall the size. You could probably walk over to the plumbing department, find the kind of fixture you're working on, carry it over to the tool dept to determine the correct socket size.

You can try to use a standard socket, but it won't work because the stem is too long. I think you can figure out the size of the deep socket you want that way.

Good luck,

PS